Topic: New Server being setup

[mercyh]

Can you draw us a picture?

I am having a hard time understanding just where your SME is in your network.

It sounds like it could be like this.

   Wan
     v
Speedstream
     v
     v
Netgear
     v
Cisco Catalyst
  v            v
Lan           v
            SME (with ports forwarded or in DMZ?)

If you are using a router, the router will have the Static IP address from the ISP (60.240.199.106)

The recommended setup would be that SME would be put in Server Only mode with a single network card. A static address would be assigned on the LOCAL NETWORK subnet and the internal router IP address would be set as the gateway. Any needed ports would be forwarded on the router to the static IP assigned to the SME.
   

[RKB]

Good Morning,

Thanks for your questions,

Here's the picture,
When in Server only mode;
Router
to
Cisco Switch and it has the Computers on the network and the SME (external) Ethernet Cable plugged in.

When in Server Gateway mode
Router
to
SME Server (External) ethernet card
from
SME Server (Network) ethernet card to Cisco Switch
The rest of the network in also into the Cisco Switch.

For some reason when I use the SpeedStream Router the Router can not be seen on the Network, but the NetGear router can be seen, I do not believe this is a SME issue just something in the hardware.

When in the Server / Gateway mode I think the settings in the router 'fight' the settings in the SME Server /Gateway.

Are you saying to me 'forget' using SME in Server / Gateway mode, just use it in Server Mode

[electroman00]

It's really difficult to understad your layout.

Internet >>>   DG834 |>>>    SME (gateway mode) >>>     Switch1 >>>    SME Lan Clients
                             |
                             | >>> Switch2 >>> Lan Clients

Can you Lay it out something like this and if you have two different setups, layout each one.

Thanks

[RKB]

Sorry for the confusion.

SME in Server Only mode uses one ethernet card (eth0)
SME in Server/Gateway mode uses two cards (eth0) and (eth1)

so I have it setup like this,

SME in Server Only Mode:
Internet >>>   DG834 >>> Cisco Switch >>>  SME (eth0) and LAN Clients.

SME in Server / Gateway Mode:
Internet >>>   DG834 >>> SME (eth0) | SME (eth1) >>> Cisco Switch and LAN Clients

I hope this is clearer

[mercyh]

Are you saying to me 'forget' using SME in Server / Gateway mode, just use it in Server Mode

If the Speedstream is truely a router and not a modem set in "bridge" mode I would not use SME as a server gateway. If you have any other forwards on the LAN you will have not end of headaches getting them to work through two router/gateways.

If the speedstream is a modem that is not routing (only connecting you to your ISP's WAN router that is in their office), you have the choice of using SME in Server/Gateway mode directly behind the Speedstream or using another routing device and putting the SME in Server only mode on the local LAN.

With SME in Server only mode you only forward the ports you need to the SME box. The downside is that when you enable a "new" service on the SME you must set the port forwards for that service.

With SME as the Gateway most of the firewall ports are opened by enabling (and closed by disabling) services in server-manger on the SME. The one caveat is that all other forwards to the LAN are handled on the SME. This may, or may not, be more difficult then setting them up on a stand alone router.

My ISP has allocated my Static IP of 60.240.199.106, Sub 255.255.255.255 the ISP Gateway server is 202.7.162.162

This line makes no sense to me as an IP of 60.240.199.106 with a subnet mask of 255.255.255.255 cannot "see" the gateway address of 202.7.162.162. This setting cannot work without the ISP doing some sort of background magic. The Gateway address MUST be in the routeable subnet and that is not the case with this statement.

[mercyh]

RKB,

Do you have the SME and the clients able to connect to the internet and lan with either one of your configurations shown?

Do you still have a problem or have you resolved it?

(I am not sure if your original problem has been resolved)

[RKB]

Thanks for reply and info,
I will consider which way to go during the day, server only or server / gateway.

Where I am up to at the moment.
The server can see the internet.
The network can see the SME server.
The network can not see or connect to the internet through SME.

Thanks 

[RKB]

Hi Mercyh,
I have decided that I would prefer to use the Gateway Server Mode.

So as I mentioned before, The SME box can connect to the Internet on the External nic, and the Network can see the SME box, but the computers on the network can not connect to the internet.

I am confused about two settings;
1) The External Static IP is this from the ISP or me
2) The Gateway IP is this my Modem IP or the ISP's default Gateway IP

Comments would be appreciated,

[mercyh]

The IP address, Subnet Mask and Gateway assigned to the external interface of the SME box are all supplied by your ISP. The only way the Gateway would be the Modem's IP address would be if the Modem is actually set up as a router. If your ISP gave you a gateway address when they gave you your static IP address this is the one you want set on the external interface. If your server can complete the internet connection test on the setup screens, this is working OK and you can eliminate this as your problem.

If you are assigning IP addresses on the workstations, You do not need to know anything about what the external IP's are.

Lets say your INTERNAL (LAN) IP address on the SME is 192.168.1.1 with a subnet mask of 255.255.255.0 (This is possibly the most common simple setting). If you have DHCP turned off on the SME server you can assign any unused address from 192.168.1.2-192.168.1.254 with a subnet mask of 255.255.255.0. The gateway would be 192.168.1.1 (the internal (LAN) address of the SME which is your GATEWAY/router). With what you describe above where the SME can see the internet and the Workstations can see the SME but NOT route to the internet, if all other setting are correct, you must have an incorrect gateway set on the WORKSTATIONS.

One way to test this is to turn ON the DHCP server on the SME and set one workstation to obtain an IP automatically. This should eliminate this problem as the SME will hand out proper settings.

Another thing that could be causing this problem is if you have another router/server acting as a DHCP server that is handing out an incorrect gateway. You WILL have problems if you have 2 DHCP servers running on the same network. (Yes, there are exceptions to this rule in advanced network situations but I don't think this is one of those situations.)

IF you are using DHCP server on the SME and choose to assign some IP addresses, you must set the DHCP server to only hand out a range of addresses (e.g. 192.168.1.100-192.168.1.200). You can then assign addresses that are outside of this range without a conflict.


Please let us know if this resolves your problem and post back if you need further information.

[electroman00]

RKB

Keep in mind, the more relevant and accurate the info you give, the more and better the help will be given.

My guess is that you may not know how to copy/paste the info requested to your WinXP client to post it here.
Which would make things a lot easier and quicker.

You may want to take some time and learn how to use these tools if you haven't already done so.
If your using WinXP then go here SFTP and set this up and suggest using notepad+++ if you don't have a favorite editor, the link is on the page.
The three tools are WinSCP, putty and an editor.
You can make a connection to SME's gateway LAN and you will be able to copy/paste SME info to winxp to post here.

When in Server Gateway mode
Router
to
SME Server (External) ethernet card (requires a static IP assignment from the pre-router 4200 or 834)
from
SME Server (Network) ethernet card to Cisco Switch
The rest of the network in also into the Cisco Switch.

The last two highlighted can not be on the same subnet.

You will need separate switches or a vlan switch to accomplish that setup.
OR
You can disconnect SME or the router LAN from the Cisco switch, one or the other.
Your choice.

Internet  >>>  DG834 1|  >>> SME (gateway mode) SME Lan  >>>  Switch1  >>>  SME LAN Clients
                              2|                                                                        \
                                                                                     hardwired connected via switch and on same subnet
                              3|                                                                        /
                              4| DG834 LAN >>>                                    Switch1  >>>  Lan Clients

What you have is SME's internal interface connected thru the Cisco (switch1) to the LAN of the 4200 or DG834 and the subnets are the same.
SpeedStream is obviously using a different default subnet for it's LAN.

That's why one works and one doesn't.

As you can see above, by making those connections to the Cisco (irregardless of the subnet) or (whether it works or not), you will have
circumvented SME's gateway firewall via the DG834 LAN and likewise circumvented the DG834 firewall via SME's LAN.

As well as create a routing issue, possible duplicate responders at the switch cannot respond, thus some routing confusion.

One possible solution...

Internet  >>>  DG834 1| DMZ  >>> (static IP assignment) to SME (gateway mode) SME Lan  >>>  Switch1  >>>  SME LAN Clients
                              2|
                              3|
                              4| DG834 LAN >>> Switch2 >>> Lan Clients

That will work if all is setup correctly.
Switches 1 & 2 can be substituted with a single vlan switch.

This line makes no sense to me as an IP of 60.240.199.106 with a subnet mask of 255.255.255.255 cannot "see" the gateway address of 202.7.162.162.
This setting cannot work without the ISP doing some sort of background magic.
The Gateway address MUST be in the routeable subnet and that is not the case with this statement.

No magic.

Should be...

Static IP = 60.240.199.106
Mask = 255.255.255.255
Gateway server = 60.240.199.1
DNS Server = 202.7.162.162

Since the ISP was never reported back for checking, it's just a good WAG and knowing that 202.7.162.162 is a DNS server.

The above info is for the modem/router, not to be used to config SME, except for the DNS Server which may need to be set in SME.

Please report this info....using this manual, which I believe is for your DG834 http://kbserver.netgear.com/pdf/dg834_reference_manual_2.pdf

A snapshot of the Router Status of the DG834 manual page 5-4.

AND

SME ifconfig results.

Without that info, nobody can effectively help you.

If the Speedstream is truely a router and not a modem set in "bridge" mode I would not use SME as a server gateway. If you have any other forwards on the LAN you will have not end of headaches getting them to work through two router/gateways.

The Speedstream & DG834 are both ADSL routers, modem/router devices.
So bridging is not an option if used for WAN access & routing.
Also with these units it's likely if you bridge them you will loose ADSL+ capability, you'll be ADSL.

If the speedstream is a modem that is not routing (only connecting you to your ISP's WAN router that is in their office), you have the choice of using SME in Server/Gateway mode directly behind the Speedstream or using another routing device and putting the SME in Server only mode on the local LAN.

Doesn't matter if it's routing or not routing, it's dependent on the type of routing....... 1 to many or..... 1 to 1.

Server-only.... 1 to many or 1 to 1.          (1 to many will work, you have to chase the dynamic IP of the server)
Server-Gateway only 1 to 1.                   (1 to many yields double NAT unlike server-only, no internal gateway)

IOW Server-Gateway mode will NOT work when deployed within the DHCP address pool, whereas (not ideally) Server-only mode will.

However SME will work Server-Gateway mode if you assign a static IP outside the DHCP address pool of the pre-routing.

So either SME modes should be setup 1 to 1 NAT, static IP and also on the DMZ of the router not the LAN.

Don't know why people on this forum keep telling others to put their server on a LAN.

Maybe you all should do some research and realize why.....no one should ever suggest that to anyone.

The implications of suggesting that can be extremely severe to that individual, under the right conditions.

There's a very few instances where server-only mode is required and strips away many options you may desire to have, that Gateway mode offers.

If you can't switch from server-only mode to gateway mode and everything works as it should, then you have a foobar network setup
or you have cabling or SME NIC problems.

That Simple.

Also the problem with the Speedstream 4200 and DG834 is that they employ "virtual DMZ" not "physical DMZ".

IOW they only have one hardware internal interface electronics thus the "virtual DMZ" capability.

However they work great for the gamers because, that's what they were designed to be used for.

As for using them with a server, that's an entirely different ball game.

There are ADSL Routers that have daul or multi hardware interfaces within them, however they cost a bit more and are designed to work with servers.

The other choices are...
1. Use one unit as modem/router and the other bridged as only a router and use it for routing to server.
    The bridge router in essence becomes a DMZ router to the server/s
2. Use one  modem/router and purchase another plain router and use that for the server.

Both will need some networking expertise as well as #1 device configuration expertise.
Both the 4200 & 834 have hidden configuration screens that you would need to access to make the changes.
So #2 is your better option of the two above.

What your trying to accomplish from what you have depicted so far, requires the following equipment.

1. ADSL+ Router with daul or multi hardware interfaces.
2. two independent switches or a single vlan switch.

Otherwise you will have to make some changes in your network setup.

hth
Happy New Year....

[electroman00]

RKB

Stupid me, I somehow missed your reply#18 post.
I'm sorry.

Did I get your layout wrong in the previous post?

I think I might have confused things a bit.

[mercyh]

RKB,

Let us know if you get this working or if you still need input.

[RKB]

Thanks,
I am waiting on my ISP to confirm the IP and other addresses I have been given are correct.

Will be back here with results as soon as they come to hand.

[mercyh]

RKB,

If your server can complete the internet connection test on the setup screens, this is working OK and you can eliminate this as your problem.

You do not need to verify the ISP info if the above statement is true.

Run the following from the command prompt on one of your workstations (assuming you are using windows workstations):

Code: [Select]

ipconfig /all
and verify that the Gateway address on the workstation is the LAN IP address you assigned to (eth1) on the server.

[electroman00]

RKB

From the #18 post

SME in Server / Gateway Mode:
Internet >>>   DG834 >>> SME (eth0) | SME (eth1) >>> Cisco Switch and LAN Clients

SME in Server / Gateway Mode:
Internet >>>   DG834 >>> SME (eth1) | SME (eth0) >>> Cisco Switch and LAN Clients

That just a typo or....

Might you have them swapped.