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Need to upgrade from 7.5 to 8.x, but...

Offline NomadOfNorad

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Need to upgrade from 7.5 to 8.x, but...
« on: November 04, 2015, 05:37:01 AM »
Okay, I have a bit of a problem.  Ages ago, I should have upgraded from SME Server 7.5.1 to SME Server v8.0, due to the former being depreciated.... but anxieties that Something Could Go Wrong gave me the screaming heebeejeebees, so I put it off till later.  Now, here it is several years after that and I've still not done it.  My email machine works fine, though... except recently when I went to the Mail sorting rules interface for one of my mail accounts, and go to click the Add New Rule button, the page takes ages trying to load, and then it gives me a Proxy Error.  Since 7.5.1 is no longer supported, I figured this meant it was time to finally bite the bullet and install 8.0, since likely no one would be interested in helping me troubleshoot 7.5.1 anymore.

My problem is... some ages ago, I got misdirected off into installing some enhanced version of somethingorother in yum, something that called itself an "upgrade of" one of the existing elements of the system, because some element wasn't working right at the time (my hazy recollection was of either emails not going out, or not coming in, or some other email transitionary thing).  It also turned out the thing I got confused into installing didn't solve the problem, probably had nothing at all to do with the problem, and that the problem wound up being solved by my doing one of the regular updates from the web interface later... but its been so long, I can't remember anything specific beyond that.

According to the page here... << http://wiki.contribs.org/SME_Server_8 >> ...I need to do the upgrade onto a clean machine, meaning one without contribs or other modifications added.  Far as I can tell, the one thing I installed as an "upgrade" of something via yum made no functional difference at all to how my system worked... and I haven't made any OTHER changes under the hood... but it gives me a fresh feeling of EEEEK!!!! Somethings gonna go wrong!!!

So, how do I determine what I'd "upgraded" via yum, so I can revert it back to what was before?  Or, depending on what it was... determine if it's something I can simply ignore (since updating to 8.0 would presumably wipe all the old executables from the older Centos and SME anyway) and so just a matter of changing something out in the templates folder?

Ideally, I just want to make sure all my emails, and all my settings involving what to do with those emails (i.e. send stuff with these headings and stuff to THAT subfolder in THAT mailbox when they arrive), get 100% transitioned over to the new system without any of them getting lost in the changeover.  I don't really care about preserving the configs of any "upgraded," under-the-hood this or that doohillies from the previous, now-obsolete version of my server software.  But, the accumulated number of emails is too large to do a backup-to-desktop that I could otherwise later restore from, so it looks like my only choice of action (short of imaging the whole dang drive to another drive) is to hope the update to 8.0 goes through without Major Whoopsies along the way.

So, where do I go from here? oO
« Last Edit: November 04, 2015, 05:40:46 AM by NomadOfNorad »

Offline janet

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Re: Need to upgrade from 7.5 to 8.x, but...
« Reply #1 on: November 04, 2015, 06:41:08 AM »
NomadOfNorad

Firstly drop the scaredycat heebeejeebies talk.

SME server should upgrade reliably & has been designed & thoroughly tested to do that.
Having said that, if you have made lots of changes to your system, then anything can go wrong, but you say you have only upgraded one package, so there should not be any serious issues there.

Most important is that you do a full system backup, either in server manager, backup to workstation to a locally connected USB drive, or in the admin console, to a locally connected USB drive, for the latter only connect the drive when asked.

Obviously the drive will need to be big enough for all your data, & the backup may take many many hours to complete, so be patient.
Format the backup USB drive to ext3 or 4 before hand, refer Howtos.

Then I advise you to download the SME7.6 iso, I posted a link here recently to a suitable location where you can get that.
Then do a CD/DVD upgrade to SME7.6.
There were significant changes from earlier versions, & it is best to upgrade to v7.6 before going to v8.x.

When that upgrade is complete & rebooted etc, then you can download the SME8.1 iso, burn a boot CD/DVD & upgrade your server to SME8.1.

If you have any custom templates it is advisable to move those to a safe location on the server, as they may not be compatible with the newer OS.

Also make sure you reset the yum repositories to defaults after upgrading to SME8.1. The upgrade should do this, but there have been situations where the older SME7.x repos were still in place, which will cause many problems.
There is a db command to do this in the FAQ.

All your data will be retained, all emails, ibay settings, users, mysql databases & general configuration etc will be  retained, so do not worry.

I would run a full test on your hard disks before upgrading to make sure they are not faulty.

There are many improvements in functionality & probably the somethingorother package you installed is no longer needed.

Ask again if any of that does not gel with you.

You can run commands to check what is installed beyond the original base installation, if that helps. I think SME7.x may have those.
type:
/sbin/e-smith/audittools/newrpms

Also take a look in that audittools folder & you will see other useful diagnostic tools. Some may not exist in SME7.5.x

« Last Edit: November 04, 2015, 06:44:10 AM by janet »
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guest22

Re: Need to upgrade from 7.5 to 8.x, but...
« Reply #2 on: November 04, 2015, 06:44:08 AM »
Please be aware that SME Server 9, 64 bit is the way to go. SME Server 8 (latest 8.2) is in maintenance mode only.

Offline NomadOfNorad

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Re: Need to upgrade from 7.5 to 8.x, but...
« Reply #3 on: November 04, 2015, 06:58:29 AM »
Please be aware that SME Server 9, 64 bit is the way to go. SME Server 8 (latest 8.2) is in maintenance mode only.

Hmmmm.... so, I might be better off upgrading directly to 9.0 then?  Skipping 8.x altogether?

Offline janet

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Re: Need to upgrade from 7.5 to 8.x, but...
« Reply #4 on: November 04, 2015, 07:09:05 AM »
NomadOfNorad

The only way to upgrade to SME 9.0 is via a full backup, install of fresh SME 9.0 OS, & then restore from the backup.

The underlying CentOS in SME9 does not support direct upgrade from old OS's.

I still advise you to upgrade your existing server to SME7.6 though, & then do the backup of v7.6 & restore to SME9.0.

Same comments mostly apply as earier mentioned.
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Offline NomadOfNorad

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Re: Need to upgrade from 7.5 to 8.x, but...
« Reply #5 on: November 04, 2015, 07:13:54 AM »
Okay, is there a way to do the backup onto a USB drive, but initiated via the SME web interface?  And what is the link to 7.6 iso again?   Also, I'm not sure if the old machine I have as the server is 64bit or 32bit.  It's an old Gateway Essential, with a Celeron processor.  And it has a CD drive instead of a DVD.  Yeah, it's old.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2015, 07:16:29 AM by NomadOfNorad »

Offline TerryF

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Re: Need to upgrade from 7.5 to 8.x, but...
« Reply #6 on: November 04, 2015, 07:50:52 AM »
Do your backup to a removable device, of suitable size (mem stick, HD etc) from the console, makes life a lot easier when installing new server, early on as part of the install process you are asked if you want to install backup, a simple yes, plug in the USB and give it minutes or hours depending on how much data and you are back in business.

 Going via server-manager means completing the install and doing basic configs and then setting up the backup/restore again to use the backup that you created, more steps, more chance of issues :-)
« Last Edit: November 04, 2015, 07:53:01 AM by TerryF »
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Offline janet

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Re: Need to upgrade from 7.5 to 8.x, but...
« Reply #7 on: November 04, 2015, 08:00:07 AM »
NomadOfNorad

The backup to workstation (then select local USB) is in server manager Backup or Restore panel.
I agree with Terry, it is probably more straight forward to use the admin console backup to USB (wait until asked before inserting the disk).
Login as admin to get to this, or at root prompt type
console

For SME7.6 iso see
http://forums.contribs.org/index.php/topic,52021.msg265930.html#msg265930

On a old Celeron computer with SME9 installed will run slowly when making changes in server manager etc, & CPU intensive operations such as virus scanning, & even drive array rebuilding, can be slow.
You might want to rethink using that machine for SME9.
I have put SME9 on a Celeron with 512Mb RAM, but it is a slow dog.

Most important criteria is the RAM, how much is in that old server ?

You need to ascertain whether it is 32 or 64 bit, if that old then probably 32bit.
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Offline NomadOfNorad

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Re: Need to upgrade from 7.5 to 8.x, but...
« Reply #8 on: November 04, 2015, 08:19:45 AM »
If I simply move the HDD from the old machine to a newer machine, will it run as is?

Offline Stefano

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Re: Need to upgrade from 7.5 to 8.x, but...
« Reply #9 on: November 04, 2015, 08:26:07 AM »
it depends.. it may be unable to boot (then you've to boot from cd in rescue mode and recreate initrd.. search the forums for mkinitrd)

in any case, working on the old hw, upgrade to SME8, be sure to have a good backup, then try to restore to the new hw, into SME9

Offline NomadOfNorad

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Re: Need to upgrade from 7.5 to 8.x, but...
« Reply #10 on: November 04, 2015, 08:43:37 AM »
Any idea what would be causing the proxy error on my current server and how I might fix it?  This is when I go to https://server/user/ and have selected Process Mail, at which point all the existing Mail sorting rules that I'd set for that mail account appear as normally.  When I then click the Add New Rule button, I get a really long Connecting... time, followed eventually by the proxy error.  I also notice the disk activity light on my server machine suddenly showing a LOT of activity that goes on for a good while.  oO

Would updating to SME 7.6 maybe sort this out?

Editted to add:

And the error I eventually get is this:

Proxy Error

The proxy server received an invalid response from an upstream server.
The proxy server could not handle the request GET /user/cgi-bin/userpanel-mailsort.

Reason: Error reading from remote server

Offline Stefano

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Re: Need to upgrade from 7.5 to 8.x, but...
« Reply #11 on: November 04, 2015, 08:55:55 AM »
first of all, you'd have (I have no SME7 here around to check) a /sbin/e-smith/audittools/newrpms script

it may not work because SME7's repos are unexistent, but try it and report here the output

alternatively, post here the result of
Code: [Select]
rpm -qa | grep 'e-smith'
rpm -qa | grep smeserver

we have to see which contribs you have..

Offline NomadOfNorad

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Re: Need to upgrade from 7.5 to 8.x, but...
« Reply #12 on: November 04, 2015, 09:06:47 AM »
Okay, so how would I capture the output of that to bring back over here to my Windoze machine to post it?

Offline TerryF

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Re: Need to upgrade from 7.5 to 8.x, but...
« Reply #13 on: November 04, 2015, 09:13:32 AM »
Use putty on your PC, connect to the server, run all your commands from the putty terminal and copy paste from there..

If you have not done this before you will need to enable remote access from server-manager for your local lan..
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Offline NomadOfNorad

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Re: Need to upgrade from 7.5 to 8.x, but...
« Reply #14 on: November 04, 2015, 10:07:11 AM »
Okay, what all do I need to set on the Remote Access panel at a minimum?  Lotsa options there.

guest22

Re: Need to upgrade from 7.5 to 8.x, but...
« Reply #15 on: November 04, 2015, 10:12:48 AM »
I *think* it's time to read the manual here... The guys that are trying to assist require you to have basic understanding. No offense.

Offline janet

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Re: Need to upgrade from 7.5 to 8.x, but...
« Reply #16 on: November 04, 2015, 10:25:45 AM »
NomadOfNorad

enable SSH for LAN, passwords enabled

See the problems you create for yourself by not regularly updating. The FUD factor got you.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fear,_uncertainty_and_doubt
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Offline TerryF

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Re: Need to upgrade from 7.5 to 8.x, but...
« Reply #17 on: November 04, 2015, 11:17:54 AM »
Picture is worth etc etc see attached
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Offline NomadOfNorad

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Re: Need to upgrade from 7.5 to 8.x, but...
« Reply #18 on: November 04, 2015, 11:21:47 AM »
first of all, you'd have (I have no SME7 here around to check) a /sbin/e-smith/audittools/newrpms script

it may not work because SME7's repos are unexistent, but try it and report here the output

alternatively, post here the result of
Code: [Select]
rpm -qa | grep 'e-smith'
rpm -qa | grep smeserver

we have to see which contribs you have..

okay, invoking rpm -qa | grep 'e-smith' yields:


e-smith-radiusd-2.0.0-1.el4.sme
e-smith-LPRng-2.0.0-1.el4.sme
warning: only V3 signatures can be verified, skipping V4 signature
e-smith-portforwarding-2.0.0-3.el4.sme
e-smith-devtools-2.0.0-2.el4.sme
e-smith-php-2.0.0-2.el4.sme
e-smith-5.0.0-1.el4.sme
e-smith-cvm-unix-local-2.0.0-1.el4.sme
e-smith-domains-2.0.0-1.el4.sme
e-smith-proftpd-2.0.0-1.el4.sme
e-smith-apache-2.0.0-6.el4.sme
e-smith-base-5.0.0-15.el4.sme
e-smith-formmagick-2.0.0-3.el4.sme
e-smith-lib-compspec-2.0.0-1.el4.sme
e-smith-packetfilter-2.0.0-1.el4.sme
e-smith-pptpd-2.0.0-1.el4.sme
e-smith-dynamicdns-yi-2.0.0-1.el4.sme
e-smith-oidentd-2.0.0-1.el4.sme
e-smith-samba-2.0.0-12.el4.sme
e-smith-runit-2.0.0-1.el4.sme
e-smith-grub-2.0.0-2.el4.sme
e-smith-lib-2.0.0-4.el4.sme
e-smith-ingo-2.0.0-3.el4.sme
e-smith-imp-5.0.0-7.el4.sme
e-smith-hosts-2.0.0-3.el4.sme
warning: only V3 signatures can be verified, skipping V4 signature
e-smith-backup-2.0.0-37.el4.sme
e-smith-dnscache-2.0.0-1.el4.sme
e-smith-tinydns-2.0.0-1.el4.sme
e-smith-flexbackup-2.0.0-1.el4.sme
e-smith-viewlogfiles-2.0.0-1.el4.sme
e-smith-qmailanalog-2.0.0-1.el4.sme
e-smith-dynamicdns-dyndns.org-2.0.0-1.el4.sme
e-smith-dynamicdns-tzo-2.0.0-1.el4.sme
warning: only V3 signatures can be verified, skipping V4 signature
e-smith-test-2.0.0-1.el4.sme
e-smith-ntp-2.0.0-1.el4.sme
e-smith-manager-2.0.0-4.el4.sme
e-smith-nutUPS-2.0.0-2.el4.sme
e-smith-openssh-2.0.0-2.el4.sme
e-smith-turba-3.0.0-8.el4.sme
e-smith-ldap-5.0.0-2.el4.sme
e-smith-starterwebsite-2.0.0-1.el4.sme
e-smith-proxy-5.0.0-1.el4.sme
e-smith-pop3-2.0.0-1.el4.sme
e-smith-email-5.0.0-9.el4.sme
warning: only V3 signatures can be verified, skipping V4 signature
e-smith-horde-4.0.0-12.el4.sme
e-smith-ibays-2.0.0-2.el4.sme
e-smith-netatalk-2.0.0-1.el4.sme
e-smith-dynamicdns-dyndns-2.0.0-1.el4.sme
e-smith-imap-2.0.0-3.el4.sme
warning: only V3 signatures can be verified, skipping V4 signature
e-smith-qmail-2.0.0-4.el4.sme
warning: only V3 signatures can be verified, skipping V4 signature
e-smith-quota-2.0.0-2.el4.sme
e-smith-mysql-2.0.0-4.el4.sme


invoking rpm -qa | grep smeserver yields:


warning: only V3 signatures can be verified, skipping V4 signature
smeserver-locale-ja-2.0.0-32.el4.sme
smeserver-locale-pt_BR-2.0.0-32.el4.sme
smeserver-locale-et-2.0.0-32.el4.sme
smeserver-locale-he-2.0.0-32.el4.sme
smeserver-locale-sl-2.0.0-32.el4.sme
smeserver-locale-hu-2.0.0-32.el4.sme
smeserver-locale-tr-2.0.0-32.el4.sme
smeserver-locale-pl-2.0.0-32.el4.sme
smeserver-locale-ru-2.0.0-32.el4.sme
smeserver-locale-zh_CN-2.0.0-32.el4.sme
smeserver-locale-nb-2.0.0-32.el4.sme
smeserver-userpanel-0.9-11.el4.sme
smeserver-fetchmail-utf8-1.3.5-02
smeserver-audittools-1.0.0-7.el4.sme
smeserver-spamassassin-2.0.0-3.el4.sme
smeserver-locale-de-2.0.0-32.el4.sme
smeserver-locale-es-2.0.0-32.el4.sme
smeserver-locale-bg-2.0.0-32.el4.sme
smeserver-locale-nl-2.0.0-32.el4.sme
warning: only V3 signatures can be verified, skipping V4 signature
smeserver-locale-zh_TW-2.0.0-32.el4.sme
warning: only V3 signatures can be verified, skipping V4 signature
smeserver-mailsorting-1.2-18.el4.sme
smeserver-release-7.5.1-1.el4.sme
smeserver-locale-pt-2.0.0-32.el4.sme
smeserver-locale-fr-2.0.0-32.el4.sme
smeserver-support-2.0.0-9.el4.sme
smeserver-clamav-2.0.0-12.el4.sme
smeserver-locale-it-2.0.0-32.el4.sme
smeserver-locale-el-2.0.0-32.el4.sme
smeserver-locale-ro-2.0.0-32.el4.sme
warning: only V3 signatures can be verified, skipping V4 signature
warning: only V3 signatures can be verified, skipping V4 signature
warning: only V3 signatures can be verified, skipping V4 signature
smeserver-locale-da-2.0.0-32.el4.sme
smeserver-locale-sv-2.0.0-32.el4.sme
smeserver-locale-th-2.0.0-32.el4.sme
smeserver-locale-id-2.0.0-32.el4.sme
smeserver-yum-2.0.0-12.el4.sme
smeserver-qpsmtpd-2.0.0-7.el4.sme