Topic: SME alternative?

[genzil]

I notice that ClarkConnect have used my PPP RPMs (required for PPTP VPN), and have removed the changelog entries which identify the work is mine. Thanks guys!

How rude!

[pcbaldwin]

I notice that ClarkConnect have used my PPP RPMs (required for PPTP VPN), and have removed the changelog entries which identify the work is mine. Thanks guys!

Sorry about that Charlie... our intention is not to take away credit where credit is deserved.  We do this for a couple of reasons:

1) When Red Hat Enterprise Linux updates their RPMS, we like to do diffs on the spec files to see what has changed.  We also like to do diffs on the upstream spec files (for instance we compare MySQL.com's spec file to Red Hat's spec file).  Updates can come fast and furions sometimes ( http://rhn.redhat.com/errata/rhel4as-errata.html ), and the RPM changelogs just get in the way.  So, we usually just delete them.  A typical user isn't running "rpm -q --queryformat {....}" to look at the changelogs, so RPM changelogs won't be missed.

2) This is a bit of a personal pet peeve -- I don't like seeing information duplicated and I don't like inconsistency.  Most packages have their own "Changelog" or "CHANGELOG" file, so why does rpm try to duplicate it?

Peter Baldwin
CTO Point Clark Networks

[CharlieBrady]

I notice that ClarkConnect have used my PPP RPMs (required for PPTP VPN), and have removed the changelog entries which identify the work is mine. Thanks guys!

Ho, that is ugly! GPL is not FREEWARE, i think. Why does nobody take these guys to court?

The GPL doesn't preclude what they've done. I consider it "impolite", but it's within the provisions of the license.

[CharlieBrady]

1) When Red Hat Enterprise Linux updates their RPMS, we like to do diffs on the spec files to see what has changed. ... the RPM changelogs just get in the way.

I'm sure that it's not beyond your team's coding skills to run the diff while suppressing changelog noise.

A typical user isn't running "rpm -q --queryformat {....}" to look at the changelogs, so RPM changelogs won't be missed.

A typical user isn't, but that doesn't mean no user does. Provenance and history are important when it comes to open source software. Changelogs *are* missed.

2) This is a bit of a personal pet peeve -- I don't like seeing information duplicated and I don't like inconsistency.  Most packages have their own "Changelog" or "CHANGELOG" file, so why does rpm try to duplicate it?

In my experience, rpm changelogs very rarely duplicate changelogs of the original package. They are either the only changelog (e.g. e-smith-* rpms) or they document RPM packaging changes (e.g. the various VPN related patches in the PPP RPM under discussion).

[pcbaldwin]

You can't argue with someone who knows how to use the word "provenance"!  We will start maintaining the RPM changelogs.

[gordonr]

A typical user isn't running "rpm -q --queryformat {....}" to look at the changelogs...

"rpm -q --changelog <rpm>" is much easier to remember and type than the %escapes of --queryformat.

Peter - Many thanks for your positive follow-up.

[gregswallow]

Peter just shared their work in progress on Open-Xchange - lets give him a break, it's nice to see some cooperation here.  And btw, those spec files didn't have changelogs either, so I don't think it's a conspiracy against you in this case Charlie.

[CharlieBrady]

We will start maintaining the RPM changelogs.

Thanks Peter. Much appreciated.

[NickR]

I recently came across these guys http://www.axentra.com/ who seem to have a very nicely rounded product.  I haven't looked at it in any great detail, but it does look interesting.

[bugme]

Axentra looks interesting.

When I first looked at axentra, i was wondering if it was netmax, and the company had changed its name, so common these days, as they have various bundle packages, just like netmax. but it looks like its definitely a different company, and product.

Originally, when I was first looking to implement a linux-based server/router, a replacement for clients existing sun cobalt qube2 server appliances, i narrowed down the choices to two distros:
SME (e-smith at the time) and Netmax.

It was by chance (and the fact that SME was free, netmax was not) that i tried installing SME first, and then i got used to it, and liked it, and never looked back.

So now that Netmax has free, older versions for download, and now, even a client linux distro live cd free download, it might be time to revisit again.
http://www.ecommerce-guide.com/news/news/article.php/10375_2247681

Netmax $200 reseller partner program:
http://netmax.com/partners/partners.html


anybody have any experience with netmax? or axentra?


I was trying to view the screenshots for axentra but the links are ignored when i click on them in firefox. IE only?
http://www.axentra.com/press/screen_shots.html

thanks.

[DarkMirage]

Ie doesn't get it either...

Combine the following for those screenshots:
http://www.axentra.com/images/screenshots/800x600px_screencaps/
mac_portals.jpg
mac_email.jpg
mac_email_compose.jpg
mac_calendar.jpg
mac_calendar_newevent.jpg
mac_calendar_newcontact.jpg
mac_bookmarks_editbookmark.jpg
mac_filemanager.jpg
mac_photoalbum.jpg
mac_notes.jpg
mac_settings.jpg
mac_blog_entry.jpg