Topic: Ethernet woes

[rhys]

Well, I found my 3com combo card in my Windows 98 box seems to have an auto-configuring option that'll allow me to use either RJ45 or BNC - whichever I choose to plug in, whenever.

The Sitecom card in my Linux box doesn't have Linux drivers (even though it says Linux compatible on the package). A download from the company website produced these instructions. I'm still trying to work out what they actually mean. Do they mean that the Ethernet card actually has been accepted by SME or do they mean "No, our Linux-compatible card really isn't Linux compatible but we'll say it is because we'll give you loads of technical info to tell you how to write your own driver" (in the latter instance, I'll complain to Trading Standards about misleading packaging).

So far, I haven't been able to get a squeek out of the Linux box from my Windows boxes. I've tinkered so much, trying to get it to work that I must know more about Windows than Bill Gates. I've also, somehow, managed to "lose" the computer symbol from Network Neighbourhood too. Any ideas on that one, anybody?

My NT box needs a new PCMCIA card because the configuration software just doesn't work. It doesn't work under NT (complaining about the memory management system and demanding it be changed to mm386) and it just hangs under DOS.


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*                                                                           *
*                     32-Bit PCI Fast Ethernet Adapter                      *
*                                                                           *
*                      Driver Installation for LINUX                        *
*                                                                           *
*****************************************************************************

  Contents:
  ---------
    A) Driver Installation by Using Kernel Built-in Driver
    B) Kernel Doesn't Support Driver

A) Driver Installation by Using Kernel Built-in Driver
   ===================================================
   Some LINUX kernels had supported rtl8139 NIC. You can check whether
   rtl8139.o exists or not. If your LINUX (ex. RedHat 6.1 or above) can
   auto-detect rtl8139 NIC, you just skip the following installations and
   follow the screen's instructions to install rtl8139.o driver directly.

   1. Check the driver file "/lib/modules/2.2.XX/net/rtl8139.o".
      Where the XX is the version number of the latest kernel.

   2. Add "alias eth0 rtl8139" into the /etc/conf.modules file.

      cd /etc
      vi conf.modules
         alias eth0 rtl8139

   3. Run the following commands at the LINUX prompt.

      modprobe rtl8139

      ifconfig eth0 192.74.53.10

   4. Now, you can run 'ifconfig' or 'netstat -i' to see if there is a
      interface 'eth0'.


B) Kernel Doesn't Support Driver
   =============================
   If your kernel doesn't support RTL8139 NIC, you should compile driver
   by yourself. Please contact http://www.scyld.com/network/rtl8139.html
   to get source code. The compiler command is located on the end of source
   code. Maybe like "gcc -DMODULE -Wall -Wstrict-prototypes -O6 -c rtl8139.c".
   If you couldn't compile success, maybe you should refer to error message
   and copy library or head file to Linux.


----
All trademarks or brand names mentioned are properties
of their respective companies.

Rhys

[del]

Hi Rhys,
This is my understanding, if you go to the sme server console and select option 2 " Configure this server"
the first setting is your domain, press enter, the second setting is your server's name, press enter and the third setting is your ethernet card, if your rtl-8139 is shown here then it will have been found by sme. If it is not shown there is an option to "manually select driver for local ethernet adapter" if you choose this option then choose option 1 "Choose driver by specifying ethernet adapter model"
then scroll down the list and the rtl-8139 is in there (I have just checked on my server) so I assume you select this and press enter.
I am new to sme myself so maybe someone can confirm this is correct.
I have 2 sme boxes (I use 1 to practice on before I install anything to the other)and both have this same nic, and both were found on install.
Hope this helps.
Del

[Andrej Fercic]

Correct !!!

[Robert]

The RedHat kernel used in SME Linux includes the 8139too ethernet driver for your nic. It's a modified version of the rtl8139 driver. Your nic will be autodetected in the configuration sequence. The configuration tool will write the correct lines to /etc/modules.conf, so don't mess with this yourself.
BTW: the nic manufacturer is not asking you to write your own driver, but only to compile one that was written by Donald Becker. You don't have to do this for SME, because a working driver is already included with the kernel.
Please read the manual from cover to cover, it's on the installation cdrom.

[rhys]

Well, I read the manual. I read the manual ages ago. I even printed it out and read the printed version.

I've just scrolled down to rtl8139too and selected that. No luck though. The computer is still not recognised as being on the network and is still unpingable.

I have to conclude that, as members of one of the local Linux groups said "SME Linux sounds a bit broken".

It should not be necessary to have to mess about for the best part of a month, trying this and that to get the thing to work. If it's good software, it doesn't need all that messing around in order to get it to work. It's obviously not good software.

On Wednesday I'm going over to Red Hat. I need a working server and so far SME Linux has proven itself NOT to work under any circumstances.

Rhys

[Tim]

Rhys,

I like you came from the MS world. I loaded SME for the first time, I also had issues with the network card, mine was not supported. I installed a 3COM that was listed in the supported section and the server came right up. I have been using my server for over 6 months. The origional server died, I moved the hard disk to a newer box and it also came up the first time and has been running great. The only problem I have had is my Web server not accessable from the outside along with port 25, these are working now and appears they were due to my ISP. So if you have not been able to get yours working in a month, then I would make sure I was using supported hardware and not try to make an unsupported nic work.

[rhys]

Well, if SME won't support hardware that has a label that says "Linux compatible" then I'm not going to throw good money after bad and buy more and more different bits. There's a limit to both money and patience. Patience ran out today.

Basically, if SME Linux won't work on my system then I'm not going to change my system in vain attempts to make the unworkable work.

SME Linux is going in the bin with all the other household rubbish and good riddance! I'm now going to get either Red Hat or NT Server. I'll give Red Hat a go but if it causes any problems at all then I'm definitely going to use a proper O/S - NT Server.

SME is just a geek-toy for people who prefer to mess about than to perform a task, IMO.

Rhys

[Dan Brown]

Rhys, I'm sorry SME didn't work for you.  However, your assertion that "SME Linux has proven itself NOT to work under any circumstances" is just flat wrong--it's worked well for me, and many, many other users, for quite some time (in my case, about three and a half years).  If you're done with it, then so long--don't let the door hit you on the way out.

[Bill Talcott]

rhys wrote:
>
> Well, if SME won't support hardware that has a label that
> says "Linux compatible" then I'm not going to throw good
> money after bad and buy more and more different bits. There's
> a limit to both money and patience. Patience ran out today.

There are many Linux variants. It's about the same as saying "Windows compatible", which might mean it works in Win3.1, but not WinXP. Many Linux users specifically don't like running precompiled software, so "compatible" may only mean that there's code available to make it work.

> Basically, if SME Linux won't work on my system then I'm not
> going to change my system in vain attempts to make the
> unworkable work.

I agree that you shouldn't have to change everything around to make one thing work. However, I've never really liked Realtek NICs. Realtek chipsets seem to be very common in the cheapy NICs, the kind where they use several different chipsets without changing the model number, and stuff like that. Personally, I'd spend the $10 on a new card and try that. I love my Netgear FA310TX's...

> SME Linux is going in the bin with all the other household
> rubbish and good riddance! I'm now going to get either Red
> Hat or NT Server. I'll give Red Hat a go but if it causes any
> problems at all then I'm definitely going to use a proper O/S
> - NT Server.

Well, since SME is based on Redhat, I'd expect similar problems there. However, SME is a very specific piece of software, and Redhat's greater scope may get you past the problem.

> SME is just a geek-toy for people who prefer to mess about
> than to perform a task, IMO.

We've been running SME for a while now (since 4.1.2) on an old PC we had sitting around. 225MHz Cyrix CPU with 64MB and 4GB. In all honesty, it's been the most stable and useful (as far as adding handy new features) of our servers (including a WinFrame server and an NT4 PDC). It sounds to me like you've hit some weird problem, and are being a bit stubborn about it. If your NIC is on the HCL, send Mitel a bug report. If not, simply swapping to a NIC that is might solve all your problems.

I hope you can get SME to work for you. It's one of the best pieces of software I've found in the past few years. And it's free to boot.

[dave]

Rhys,

I have to agree with Dan, my SME installation is working fine and has been for quite a while (close to 2 years now).  I said in a previous post to you, there are hundreds, possibly thousands of SME users out there that are having no problems, this means SME does work and it works well.  

Your desire to stick with Linux is admirable but in going with RedHat there's one thing to keep in mind: SME is based on RedHat.  This means if you're experiencing difficulties with hardware support on SME, you'll likely have the same problems with RedHat.

Good luck, I think you'll need it...
Dave

[rhys]

Until Linux really gets sorted out with drivers, I think I'm probably going to have to keep trying different flavours. I wonder whether I'll ever get to use the computer I built a month or more back?

Essentially, I want to use Linux because it's reputedly more stable than Windows. And because I'll be running it as a server. I don't mind trying different versions of Linux. I just get very narked when people tell me I've done something wrong when it's plainly a problem that lies elsewhere.

Windows has almost got the drivers bit sorted out. My puzzle though is why Linux hasn't been modified to use Windows drivers. That, to me, would seem to be an obvious thing to do.

Rhys

[del]

Hi Rhys,
Just a quickie before you give up completly, have you got Netbeui installed on the windows machines? I had problems with a NT4 server because I had tcp/ip set up on the server and tcp/ip, along with Netbeui on my workstations, I uninstalled netbeui and hey presto the NT4 server became available, I have since replaced this over-priced, over rated "reboot every few days" piece of software with SME and it works great and I don't even need a monitor for it! I also tried other versions of Linux but found that you needed at lot more experience in Linux or Unix to get them to do what SME does out of the box, I wish you the best of luck whichever way you decide to go.
Del

[rhys]

I do happen to have something called netbuei.vxd. What is it? Where does it come from? What does it do?

Rhys

[rhys]

Ok. I found nrtbuei and removed it. That meant I couldn't even find Persius on the network (from Persius). It did not magically make Zeus visible. I've now set it all back the way it was. Windows works. SME will not.

The only way to make SME work, it seems to me, is to build a machine around the bits that SME likes. I'm not prepared to do that. I built a machine with what I wanted on it. The O/S has to fit around that - Windows does so what on earth is wrong with Linux that it's so inflexible!

I gather that locally, there's a Linux group with loads of people doing exactly what I've been trying to do but with Red Hat, Debian, Mandrake and SuSe.

Well, thus far I've tried Corel Linux and it failed to install. I've tried SME and after a lot of messing around, it did finally install but then failed spectacularly to work.

I'll try Red Hat or whatever the local gurus recommend but I do believe that I'm going to end up with W2K server or NT4 server.

Rhys

[Ray Mitchell]

Rhys
You have made a number of posts on these forums and been given quite a bit of advice by people who clearly are quite knowledgeable about sme server (including myself). Your responses have consistently been to not fully listen to what you were being told. Your answers indicate that your knowledge of setting up servers and network protocols is quite poor.

You have chosen to blame sme server as being the problem rather than accept  that your lack of knowledge, understanding and experience are the problem.

The sme server software works quite well, it has certain parameters under which it will work OK and under which it will NOT work OK. You must stay within those parameters no matter what you think or believe, just like any other OS including various flavours of Windows. Hardware compatibility is essential or you are just wasting your time, incompatible hardware won't work just because you wish it would !

You need to read AND ABSORB what is being said in BOTH the manuals. If you don't understand something, then ask here.

It appears that your NIC is supported by sme so therefore the way you have configured the server or you network is the most likely problem (and it commonly is).

You might want to post details here of what your network setup generally is, and then give details of the configuration settings in your server (server manager Review configuration panel). Is this the only server on your network, are all machines set for TCP/IP only, do all machines have the same workgroup name, is your server set as primary domain controller and DHCP server, are the workstations configured correctly for this, are the IP's of all machines in the same range as the server's IP. Also if you log in as admin, and on the server console menu select Configure this server, then make a note of what setting you have on each and every screen and also post that info here.

I wopuld suggest that you probably don't know the answers to some of those questions, based on other answers and feedback you have posted here. Read the section sof the manual that tell you how to set up your windows workstations correctly.

I think you have some problems in these areas and another server OS is not going to solve those sort of problems.

It might also be a good idea to keep your posts on the one thread until (hopefully/if ever ?) you sort out your basic instal and configuration. That way others can follow what you have done and what comes next more easily, rather than always starting a new post (thread) on the similar subject but just a few days later.

You might also like to stop rubbishing sme server if you want people who like, use and value sme server, to help you out.

I would also suggest you don't get opinions from Linux users about an OS (sme) that they know nothing about. Of course they will call it rubbish if they don't understand it, just like you are doing.

You said
> I have to conclude that, as members of one of the local Linux
> groups said "SME Linux sounds a bit broken".

I think the only thing broken is your attitude and your brain, sorry to say !!

Regards
and good luck
Ray Mitchell